Big Pitch w/o O2 vs Smaller Pitch w/ O2

How are you fermenting?

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Ancient Abbey
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Re: Big Pitch w/o O2 vs Smaller Pitch w/ O2

Postby Ancient Abbey » Sat Jul 16, 2016 10:24 am

phishie wrote:If you were me would you do that and pitch all packs w/o O2 or just pitch 1 or 2 packs and add pure O2? No preference?


I've not been happy with yeast performance right out of the package, unless the date is only 1-2 weeks old. It's been so long since I haven't made a starter first, but when I pitched straight from the package into wort, I always added oxygen.
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Re: Big Pitch w/o O2 vs Smaller Pitch w/ O2

Postby phishie » Sat Jul 16, 2016 3:43 pm

Yeah seems there shouldn't be much downside to pitching BIG and using oxygen to boot (after pitching).
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Re: Big Pitch w/o O2 vs Smaller Pitch w/ O2

Postby Brandon » Sat Jul 16, 2016 8:13 pm

phishie wrote:
Brandon wrote:Good timing here, I have two Pilsners fermented the same way with the same yeast. One done exactly as described with well aerated starter then pitched (at high krausen) into unaerated wort. And the other batch also pitched at high krausen, but into aerated wort.

I'll try them tonight/this weekend and send any interesting thoughts.


:tu :tu


An update on my impressions on this (apologies if I misinterpreted the topic of discussion). Comparing Pilsner fermented with oxygenated wort vs un-oxygenated wort. Both are pretty similar. The oxygenated being younger and clearly not as mature. I wouldn't worry about it either way (again...for Pilsner, and Helles as well). OTOH, of three batches, the third being a Helles, the Helles is delicious! I still need to work on Pilsners. But the Helles is pretty much the stock recipe and process from the paper with 1% Melanoidin malt. Good god it's tasty. That recipe is clearly a keeper.
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Re: Big Pitch w/o O2 vs Smaller Pitch w/ O2

Postby phishie » Sun Jul 17, 2016 1:38 pm

Brandon wrote:
phishie wrote:
Brandon wrote:Good timing here, I have two Pilsners fermented the same way with the same yeast. One done exactly as described with well aerated starter then pitched (at high krausen) into unaerated wort. And the other batch also pitched at high krausen, but into aerated wort.

I'll try them tonight/this weekend and send any interesting thoughts.


:tu :tu


An update on my impressions on this (apologies if I misinterpreted the topic of discussion). Comparing Pilsner fermented with oxygenated wort vs un-oxygenated wort. Both are pretty similar. The oxygenated being younger and clearly not as mature. I wouldn't worry about it either way (again...for Pilsner, and Helles as well). OTOH, of three batches, the third being a Helles, the Helles is delicious! I still need to work on Pilsners. But the Helles is pretty much the stock recipe and process from the paper with 1% Melanoidin malt. Good god it's tasty. That recipe is clearly a keeper.


Cool thanks!

You're exactly on the topic of my question, I'm assuming in the aerated pilsner you aerated post pitch.
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Re: Big Pitch w/o O2 vs Smaller Pitch w/ O2

Postby missiletech » Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:49 am

Yes, over-pitching creates it's own issues. If you over-pitch the yeast are competing for oxygen and other nutrients and this will cause stress on the yeast and possible off flavors.

When you oxygenate the wort right before, or as, the yeast is being pitched it takes up the oxygen so quickly that it's not an issue.

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Another reply from white labs. So, this makes me wonder why I shouldn't start looking at majoring in chemistry or biology. I never seem to get enough information to feel I get the big picture. As in these email responses are more general than the questions I asked and I love the geeky details. But as always, if it results in good beer... do it.

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Re: Big Pitch w/o O2 vs Smaller Pitch w/ O2

Postby Ancient Abbey » Wed Jul 20, 2016 9:24 am

Grain of salt, they sell yeast for a living.

As the yeast population (# cells) double and triple in the wort, they are also increasing the competition for nutrients. Even if they didn't reproduce, as nutrients become limiting over the course of normal fermentation, there is increased competition for them. By their logic, you'll cause stress and possible off flavors regardless.

I do agree with how quickly yeast take up oxygen.
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