Attenuating too fast!

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phishie
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Attenuating too fast!

Postby phishie » Tue Aug 16, 2016 1:04 pm

This is all caveated that I am using a Tilt Hydrometer device as the basis for my gravity readings. I am away from home during the week for work most weeks so it's the best option I have for monitoring my beer while controlling temp with the brewpi. Once home again later this week I will take a normal sample to validate with a traditional hydrometer.

Anyways, with my second LODO batch (Helles) brewed this past Saturday and pitched with a full quart slurry from my first LODO batch (Festbier) I am seeing a full 9 points of attenuation per day (both 3 gallon batches)! This seems extraordinarily high.

While possibly a "good problem"; the issue I'm facing is my beer attenuating so fast it will reach 1.5 P above FG a day or more before my temps reach 5-6 C. Furthermore I'm now expecting it to attenuate below 1.5 P above FG before I can get home to transfer to secondary. These problems no one can solve, so what I'm really wondering is if this observed speed of attenuation is abnormal? Did I just pitch waaaay too much yeast?

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Bilsch
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Re: Attenuating too fast!

Postby Bilsch » Tue Aug 16, 2016 1:14 pm

I used one of these brewometers for 5 batches and never got any useful gravity information from it. Sometimes being as much as 0.015 off either high or low. I think it's bubbles and other matter that sticks to the casing but either way it's just not accurate enough to try to predict when to spund. Temperature info seemed pretty accurate though.
phishie
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Re: Attenuating too fast!

Postby phishie » Tue Aug 16, 2016 1:23 pm

Bilsch wrote:I used one of these brewometers for 5 batches and never got any useful gravity information from it. Sometimes being as much as 0.015 off either high or low. I think it's bubbles and other matter that sticks to the casing but either way it's just not accurate enough to try to predict when to spund. Temperature info seemed pretty accurate though.


Wouldn't you agree if gives accurate enough info to evaluate the trend and roughly estimate 45% attenuation and 1.5P above FG?
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Bilsch
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Re: Attenuating too fast!

Postby Bilsch » Tue Aug 16, 2016 3:55 pm

To be honest.. I'm not sure. I didn't use a graph and while looking at the meter regularly the fluctuations in readings made it almost impossible to decide the correct point to transfer and spund. Each beer was different though and accuracy depended a lot on how much braun hefe was floating and how vigorous the co2 evolution. Your results will most certainly vary from mine. Would have been great if it had worked better but in retrospect I wish I'd spent the money on something else more useful.
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Ancient Abbey
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Re: Attenuating too fast!

Postby Ancient Abbey » Mon Aug 22, 2016 10:57 pm

1L of slurry is 2-4 trillion cells (2-4 billion per ml). You are going to see the gravity drop very quickly at that rate.
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phishie
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Re: Attenuating too fast!

Postby phishie » Tue Aug 23, 2016 8:42 am

Ancient Abbey wrote:1L of slurry is 2-4 trillion cells (2-4 billion per ml). You are going to see the gravity drop very quickly at that rate.


I need to correct my post, it was about 300-400 ml of slurry in a 1L jar once the slurry settled from the beer. I decanted most of the beer prior to pitching. I guess that still means I potentially pitched >1 billion per ml which is a lot.
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Big Monk
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Attenuating too fast!

Postby Big Monk » Tue Aug 23, 2016 8:56 am

I've always used 1.2 x 10⁹ cells/ml for estimation.

By that guideline 500 ml would contain ~600 x 10⁹ cells.

I was always under the impression that the 2-4 x 10⁹ cells/ml figure assumed pure yeast.
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Brody
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Re: Attenuating too fast!

Postby Brody » Tue Aug 23, 2016 11:36 am

phishie wrote:
Ancient Abbey wrote:1L of slurry is 2-4 trillion cells (2-4 billion per ml). You are going to see the gravity drop very quickly at that rate.


I need to correct my post, it was about 300-400 ml of slurry in a 1L jar once the slurry settled from the beer. I decanted most of the beer prior to pitching. I guess that still means I potentially pitched >1 billion per ml which is a lot.


That actually bodes a question I have: Is 300ml of dense slurry under 700ml of partially fermented beer in a 1l mason jar basically the same cells as a just the 300ml of dense slurry? Or is it assumed that yeast in suspension are still significant.
brewcrew7
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Re: Attenuating too fast!

Postby brewcrew7 » Tue Aug 23, 2016 1:17 pm

Brody wrote:Or is it assumed that yeast in suspension are still significant.


A difference of fermentation properties aside, there's no reason to believe the viability would be worse than that of sedimented yeast. I can't believe the number of yeast cells would be above 5% total. Although this isn't the same, I'd imagine you could make an educated guess from its findings to apply to your question, see: http://www.woodlandbrew.com/2013/01/yea ... sited.html
phishie
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Re: Attenuating too fast!

Postby phishie » Tue Aug 23, 2016 1:20 pm

Brody wrote:
phishie wrote:
Ancient Abbey wrote:1L of slurry is 2-4 trillion cells (2-4 billion per ml). You are going to see the gravity drop very quickly at that rate.


I need to correct my post, it was about 300-400 ml of slurry in a 1L jar once the slurry settled from the beer. I decanted most of the beer prior to pitching. I guess that still means I potentially pitched >1 billion per ml which is a lot.


That actually bodes a question I have: Is 300ml of dense slurry under 700ml of partially fermented beer in a 1l mason jar basically the same cells as a just the 300ml of dense slurry? Or is it assumed that yeast in suspension are still significant.


Are you not decanting off the supernatant beer?

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